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Anton Mercer
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The development team became aware of a potential leveling exploit on Wednesday morning this week. After initial investigations, we decided to shut down access to the maps that were being used for this power-leveling to perform a deeper investigation.

The investigation uncovered several different bugs in the game that were combining to allow players to level at approximately 17x the rate that players were leveling anywhere else in the game. This was definitely not intended behavior. Fixes for the various bugs went live with the update on Thursday morning, and we opened up the blocked maps.

During the investigation, we pulled data on every player’s behavior, and then we zeroed in on the players who were gaining levels at unreasonable rates. All of these players were on the maps under investigation. We found that quite a few players dabbled in these maps, but it was really a very small number of players who decided to take advantage of the bugs in excess. In fact, in the end there were around 300 characters (spanning around 250 accounts) that crossed the line from being efficient into taking significant advantage of the bugs. 300 is a very small number from the hundreds of thousands of characters playing.

This raises the question of what an exploit is. I’ll loosely define an exploit is any unintended behavior in the game that a player can use to gain significant advantage over others. How does a player know something is unintended? That is definitely open to interpretation and was a huge focus of the discussion in the dev team. In this case, we feel that the difference in leveling speed between playing other content in the game and playing the content that was singled out this week was so large that it is reasonable for players to think “this is too good to be something the dev team intended to happen”. We find exploits regularly, but it is uncommon to find one that was used to achieve enough of an advantage to require taking action.

Once deciding that there was an exploit, the question is whether action is required or not, which means looking at who dabbled and who took advantage? This was done with an intensive data analysis. In the end, we decided that the vast majority of players were being fairly reasonable in their use of the maps to level, but there was a space in the data between players who gained up to 10 specialization points using the exploit, and those who gained more than 10 specialization points. I decided to make this the cut-off line and anyone who got more than 10 points on those maps had the excess points removed from their characters. For example, a character earning 15 points, 12 of which were on the exploitable maps, would lose 2 specialization points, and a character earning 60 points all of which were on exploitable maps would lose 50 points.

I have looked into the claim that some players were not using the exploit maps, but so far every claim I have come across has not held up under data pulls. If anyone still thinks they lost specialization points when they should not have should please file a CS ticket. CS tickets get a tracking number that can ensure we take care of everyone with a concern.

I’m certain that at least some of the players feel they were acting in the right. That errors the dev team makes should be fair game. There are likely some others who feel that I drew the line in the wrong place, either too high or too low. It is challenging to walk the line between protecting the player base that wants the game to be fair, and allowing players to be efficient and “game the game”. In this case, a judgment was made and the line was drawn in order to protect the integrity of the game for the hundreds of thousands of players who did not and cannot do this going forward. Reviewing the data further, I still feel it was a good place to draw it.

Our communication on this issue was apparently unclear. I’ll finish up this afternoon by apologizing for not being more clear about what happened. We normally do not post about actions taken to correct exploits, and I did not expect this correction to require more than a simple post. I was mistaken and I hope this clarifies what happened for those that want a more complete story.

I hope you all have a wonderful weekend.

Stephen D’Angelo
Executive Producer
Star Trek Online

Thoughts anyone? The thread currently has 51 pages of people either telling him off, thanking him, saying that "I kept all my skill points so your data is flawed" type deals, and all the usual comments. Was this really an exploit? Should they have rolled back people? Do they have any options to salvage this going forward?



Last edited by Anton Mercer on 10/26/14 19:49; edited 1 time in total


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Since I never made use of it, it's easy for me to be okay with what they did, at least from a shallow viewpoint. It requires a deeper consideration than that, though. Does their decision, and the precedent it sets, make things overall better for the game and its community or overall worse?

I'm honestly struggling a bit to see what true advantage these players/characters that leveled quicker are getting. I may be shortsighted or missing something in that regard, and I'll gladly consider perspectives that can highlight any such advantages. IF there were tiered raids (such as in WoW or other MMOs) that require progression, etc, I could see it being an advantage. If there was open world PvP that was unavoidable (aka not Ker'rat), I could see the speedily gained levels as an advantage. In this case, some powergamers got their characters to max level a lot quicker than others. Hooray for them - now what do they have left to achieve? It's the same with powergamers in just about any MMO - they rush to complete new content/levels, then whine that there's nothing to do, not realizing they've created their own situation. I digress, though.

So, again, I fail to see what, if any, significant advantage this gives them. Maybe it's that they can now do Elite difficulty queues with no difficulty, raking in the rare materials they need for crafting, and can now dominate the market with their crafted goods? I don't know.

*If* there is an actual advantage that is overall detrimental to the game and its community, then I think their decision was a sound one. 10 spec points seems to be fairly generous, as from my own experience, it can take an hour or two, at non-optimzied XP-gaining methods, mind you, to gain a level/spec point.



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Edward Hau

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yea, they are grasping at straws here if they are using the "unfair advantage" argument...



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Edward Hau wrote:

yea, they are grasping at straws here if they are using the "unfair advantage" argument...

The problem I have with the decision is that they didn't equally punish.  Those that used it excessively to gain points were punished for the most part ( huge groups that used it seemed to get "overlooked"). Those that used it to level up in a day received no punishment at all. 



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I cannot imagine what they have access to in a data pull so I can only guess at the thought process, and mine is they focused on those with spec point gains vs leveling in a day because of the advantage those points give, and seeing where level cap was reached and points given vs leveling in a day and points given.  Any action they take is not going to be popular, and they could have easily punished everyone who took part in it.  I used it for my last 3 levels and if they took those away saying I was in the wrong for something they over looked then there isn't much for me to do.  Yes they overlooked/did not mean for this to happen but they had to something.  And for those who play WoW and remember the Martin Fury(Martian Fury?) incident, big companies make mistakes too and have to correct them.  Yes there are big differences between the two incidents but in the end something had to be done, and it was very unpopular with the masses.



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I certainly took advantage in leveling up due to that exploit.  I gained a few levels.  They would certainly be just in taking those levels away from me.  It would not bother me a bit and I deserve it.  I had a great time just being with the 7th Fleet and destroying enemy ships. It was fun!  I think what is most important in this situation is the perception of "fairness" in the game.  Not! Actual fairness, but the perception of fairness. The fact that the EP took the debate about the exploit and addressed it, shows two things: (1) They (the development team) are responding to community concerns (2) They are taking an active interest when it concerns the integrity of the game.  I think this helps give the perception that they are trying to be "fair" about the game and the situation itself, especially as it was raised organically in the STO community.  In the end, those two things (response and active interest) are very important.  They could have approached the whole situation with general apathy as some thought they would... And, in the end, I think that would have been a great disservice to everyone.



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Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?  (Who guards the guardsmen or Who watches the watchmen)

Yep, Guilty as charged.  I used it for about 2 hours one night running with some 7th Fleet Homies.  Would of probably used it every night for about 2 hours to level all six of my toons.  (Too lazy to do the math on long it would take)

(Long PO'd post deleted.)

At least they tried to appease the unwashed masses of STO, but at the end of the day, Mr. D'Angleo might as well at work at EA or Monsanto.  This also begs the question; why did BranFlakes quit? 

My 2 cents.

Cheers



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This guy......doesn't care, no clue there was an exploit at all or what they are even talking about.  I've just been taking my time with leveling and enjoying the content without blasting through it.  I'm just 55, but I don't see the point in rushing levels.  At least with the grind in between leveling, the new mission at each level makes me feel rewarded and takes away the grinding feeling.



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Morgan Shackelford
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You went to this system for one reason.  It was good experience.  It wasn't just good experience, it was great.  And it wasn't just great, it was extraordinary.  Unusually extraordinary, made doubly unusual by virtue of the fact it was restricted to a patrol system in an area of the game that has nothing to do with Delta Rising.  A system from Season 7. 

There is one of two possibilities.  Either you realized this was so unusual as to not be intended by the development team, or you didn’t.  If you understood this wasn’t intended, then at the very least, you knowingly made use of an exploit.  If you didn’t come to this realization, then how you function as an adult in the real world is a mystery to me.

The attitudes being displayed here on this issue are beyond the pale.  “Is this even an exploit?”  Are you fucking kidding me?  Of course it’s an exploit, you fucking twat.  It is a bug or oversight in the coding which you took advantage of for personal gain.  That’s the goddamn textbook definition of an exploit.

That your rationalization of your own behavior stems from Cryptic’s knowledge of the issue is you engaging in what is equivalent to victim-shaming and not a relevant justification of your own behavior.  If you are walking through a parking lot, and see a car with unlocked doors and keys in still in the ignition, that is not carte blanche for you to justifiably go for a joyride.  It’s still fucking grand theft.  That you would only steal something so glaringly opportune just makes you a criminal of low skill.  Your expectation of Cryptic’s ability to be perfect and omnipotent where their creation is concerned is unreasonable.

If you find the argument that engaging in this behavior is advantageous to be weak; then by all means, feel free to pose your counter-argument.  Were you doing us all a favor, then?  Did you do it out of the goodness of your heart?  Did it make you feel Jesus-y?  Were you ‘helping the Fleet?’  I would love to hear a well-reasoned argument explaining your actions that doesn’t revolve around you gaining a personal advantage.  Whether or not you personally intended to use this advantage nefariously is not relevant to the fact that you gained one.  The advantage could be used, and if you don’t understand how, then I will go ahead and place you in the group of people who mysteriously seem to function in the real world as adults despite being incredibly fucking stupid.  All you have to do is answer the question ‘does a level 60 player have an advantage over a level 50 player?’ to arrive a basic concept of how this works.  While this is not a pvp or raid centric game lessens the degree of advantage, but if there were no advantage to be had, no one would have done it.  Furthermore, you wouldn’t level your toon at all.  Advantages to gaining experience exist.  A creative player can leverage those advantages to good effect.  A dumb one can, at the very least, drag their e-crank over the rest of us.

Equating the developers at Cryptic with the administrators of a company that literally poisons the food your children eat for monetary gain is absolutely fucking ridiculous, especially considering the fact that any punishment you received is a result of your own immoral, selfish and shitty behavior.

Further equating this bug being fixed to a nerf is only a sign of how far down the retard rabbit hole you’ve dived.  You are distorting language to serve your own selfish rationalizations, much in the same way you do when you ask the dumbass question of ‘is this an exploit.’  You are nullifying the very definition of a word so that you can justify to yourself that your behavior is acceptable.  It is not.

And seriously – who watches the watchers?  That’s a great colloquialism if you’re discussing police militarization or NSA activities.  It is not applicable here.  Cryptic did not overstep the bounds of either their authority, or of reasonable reaction.  You got off light.  I discussed this with a friend of mine who has been a long-time MMO player, but who does not play STO.  His first question upon hearing what happened was “How many members do you lose?”  He was operating under an assumption that I believe most MMO players readily understand: that either your accounts were banned by the developer, or you were kicked from the guild.  Your punishment was only that you lost a handful of spec points beyond level 60; and generally not as many as you had unfairly taken.

You are all welcome to make counter-arguments.  But don’t be surprised if you are requested to verbalize your justifications in front of the flag staff, and don’t be surprised if the issue of your membership status gets raised in doing so.  You have risked not just your own reputations and assets, but the Fleets along with it.  If you don’t understand how you did this, feel free to go stand with the stupid mysterious people.

Yes, this is a harsh post.  It’s not meant to be popular.  You are all good people who made an error in judgment, and I understand the reasons why.  Maybe you were just having fun, as I’m sure many of you were.  Maybe it’s the challenge of the thing.  I get that the world can often reward boldness, and that advantage is advantage is advantage.  Even a small advantage can mean the difference between winning and losing, and our culture isn't kind to losers.  Or maybe you’re overly analytical, and weighed the risk versus the potential rewards.  In which case, many of you made the ‘correct’ decision, as most of you gained more than you lost.  And this is just a game, right?  It doesn't matter, after all.

But if you can’t be expected to make moral decisions when it doesn't matter, then how can you be expected to when it does? 

 

Shame on all of you.  And fuck you for making me write this.  If my words anger or upset you, then go complain to higher authority, or tell me to my face.  If that’s not enough to assuage your rage, then I’ll voluntarily step down and you can go on feeling victimized.



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Anton Mercer
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sparrow794 wrote:

 

The attitudes being displayed here on this issue are beyond the pale.  “Is this even an exploit?”  Are you fucking kidding me?  Of course it’s an exploit, you fucking twat.  It is a bug or oversight in the coding which you took advantage of for personal gain.  That’s the goddamn textbook definition of an exploit.

 

Let me be clear. ANY and ALL questions asked by me in the initial post were open-ended and were posed to the fleet for discussion ONLY, and do not necessarily reflect my views or opinions on the matter. I apologize if it was construed as such, and perhaps a better way to have put it would have been "How do you think Cryptic should have handled the known exploit" or perhaps left the word "exploit" out entirely.



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sparrow794 wrote:

If you find the argument that engaging in this behavior is advantageous to be weak; then by all means, feel free to pose your counter-argument.  Were you doing us all a favor, then?  Did you do it out of the goodness of your heart?  Did it make you feel Jesus-y?  Were you ‘helping the Fleet?’  I would love to hear a well-reasoned argument explaining your actions that doesn’t revolve around you gaining a personal advantage.  Whether or not you personally intended to use this advantage nefariously is not relevant to the fact that you gained one.  The advantage could be used, and if you don’t understand how, then I will go ahead and place you in the group of people who mysteriously seem to function in the real world as adults despite being incredibly fucking stupid.  All you have to do is answer the question ‘does a level 60 player have an advantage over a level 50 player?’ to arrive a basic concept of how this works.  While this is not a pvp or raid centric game lessens the degree of advantage, but if there were no advantage to be had, no one would have done it.  Furthermore, you wouldn’t level your toon at all.  Advantages to gaining experience exist.  A creative player can leverage those advantages to good effect.

This is the only part of your post that applies to me, as I think I maybe ran it once, and that was both for the XP and to get the Romulan Marks for the Tau Dewa patrol. Maybe I'm stupid or being dense, but I honestly do not see any significant advantage gained by leveling to 60 so quickly, aside from gaining access to Elite PvE queues. You ask for a counter argument, well, I'd appreciate you helping me understand where you see a dangerous advantage. I don't doubt you do, as there has been more than one occasion, both in game and out, that your clarity has been better than mine. I'm not challenging or defying your claim, I would simply appreciate an example.

I'm not defending the actions of those that made use of the exploit; any MMO vet should have realized what was going on and realized Cryptic was going to drop the hammer sooner or later. Yes, I recognize the exploit, because it allowed players to level characters quicker. Unlike other MMOs, though, you don't gain access to any different PvE queues, just higher difficulty ones. As mentioned in my initial response, the only real advantage I see out of that is gaining access to the VR crafting materials and possibly cornering the Exchange market on certain items. ECs are nice, and can certainly help you get things you want, such as ships, ship equipment, etc.



Last edited by VADM pRett on 10/26/14 21:24; edited 1 time in total


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I would like to express my appreciation for Captain Shackelford's very thoughtful remarks.  Also, I want to apologize to him, the Fleet, and Flag Staff if my actions brought any disrepute on the fleet.  After reading, his very persuasive argument, I have come to believe I should not have participated.  There is no way for me to take it back, but I can admit my error and regret my decision.  My initial thought in participating in the exploit was exactly as you suggested in your post. (1) It would be fun (2) It is just a game.  I did not fully consider the idea of it being "real life."  In hindsight, I think behavior in the game is to some degree an extension of real life and it is not simply an area where we can abandon all ethical considerations, as you outlined.  I am aware some of you may not share Captain Shackelford's view.  My initial reaction was to say, "It is just a game,"  no one was truly harmed, this is just Wittgenstein's language game we are playing.  Making that argument would have coddled my pride.  The truth is when I tried to convince myself of that argument: I didn't even believe it.  To say it is just a game is in my view, a narrow view of the situation.  Everyone I have met in the Fleet has been good to me and I think all of you are good people.  I wish to make clear in posting this, I am making no judgements on anyone else but myself.  I merely seek to point out what I felt was lacking in my own ethical choice.  And, for that choice, I sincerely apologize.



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+1 Shack, I love this guy



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Thoughts anyone? The thread currently has 51 pages of people either telling him off, thanking him, saying that "I kept all my skill points so your data is flawed" type deals, and all the usual comments. Was this really an exploit? Should they have rolled back people? Do they have any options to salvage this going forward?

 

I feel it depends on how it was used would be my question?

IE - I paid for the buffet and came to eat. Oh look there's steak on the buffet ..Hmmm steak, I'll have one maybe two.. Try eating steak with a rusty spoon its hard to do. :Server: Hey you can't eat that steak .... :Me: oh I'm sorry I didn't know. You know it on the buffet right in plan view.....

 

I believe most of us had a piece of steak

I believe most of us didn't know it wasn't suppose to be there.

I Don't believe there are slobs here @ 7th who ate all the steak

I don't go to the buffet often and when I do, I don't feel I should have to ask what's on the buffet that I can't eat .

Its sloppy severing on there end, always has been and seem like it hasn't changed .

 

 If you were a slob then you need to pay.

on the counterpoint they need to clean up there act this game is sloppy. Rushing to fill the buffet is how these mistakes happen and there a lot of people are hungry.

I use a rusty spoon so I don't see any exploit in anything I do in game

 

Respectfully Capt. Lang

And the Rusty Spoon  > USS Trial

 



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